People of the Pod
"Why Do They Hate Us?" CNN's Bianna Golodryga on Fighting Antisemitism in Schools
In this special episode, host Manya Brachear Pashman welcomes a co-host: her 11-year-old son, Max. Together, they sit down with Emmy-winning CNN anchor Bianna Golodryga to discuss her new novel, Don't Feed the Lion. Co-written with Yonit Levy, the book tackles the viral contagion of antisemitism in schools. From the pressure of being the only Jewish kid in class to the stress of Bar Mitzvah prep, this multi-generational conversation explores the void in modern education and the power of empathy. A rare, heartwarming, and urgent bridge between the newsroom and the classroom, this discussion is a must-listen for parents, educators, and anyone looking to understand the next generation's fight against hate. A Note to Our Listeners: As we head into 2026, People of the Pod will be taking a pause. After eight years of sharing your stories, we are contemplating our next chapter. Thank you for being part of this journey. *The views and opinions expressed by guests do not necessarily reflect the views or position of AJC. Key Resources: AJC's Center for Education Advocacy Confronting Antisemitism In Our Schools: A Toolkit for Parents of Jewish K-12 Students FAQs for Parents of K-12 Jewish Students Listen – AJC Podcasts: Architects of Peace The Forgotten Exodus People of the Pod Follow People of the Pod on your favorite podcast app, and learn more at AJC.org/PeopleofthePod You can reach us at: peopleofthepod@ajc.org If you've appreciated this episode, please be sure to tell your friends, and rate and review us on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Transcript of the Interview: Manya Brachear Pashman: Bianna Golodryga is an Emmy award winning news anchor for CNN, who has reported extensively on the October 7 Hamas terror attack on Israel and Russia's invasion of Ukraine. She is a mother and she is now a published novelist. Co-written with leading Israeli news anchor Yonit Levy, Don't Feed the Lion is about how the rise of antisemitism affects Theo, his sister Annie, and their friends Gabe and Connor, all students in a Chicago middle school, and it was written with middle schoolers in mind. Bianna is with us now to discuss the book, along with my co-anchor this week, my son Max, a middle schooler who read the book as well and has a few questions of his own. I will let Max do the honors. Max Pashman: Bianna, welcome to People of the Pod. Bianna Golodryga: Well, it is a joy to be with you Manya, and especially you, Max. We wrote the book for you, for you and your peers especially. So really excited to hear your thoughts on the book. Manya Brachear Pashman: Well, I want to know, Bianna, what prompted you to write this book? Was it the mother in you or the journalist or a little bit of both? Bianna Golodryga: It was definitely a little bit of both. It was the mother in me, initially, where the idea was first launched and the seed planted even before October 7. You know, sadly, antisemitism has been with us for millennia, but I never thought that I would be having these conversations with my own kids in the city, with the largest Jewish community and population outside of Israel. But you'll recall that there were a few high profile antisemitic social media posts and controversies surrounding Kanye West and then Kyrie Irving, who's a famous NBA player at the time, and my son, who was 10 at the time, a huge sports fan, and was very upset about the fact that not only were these comments made and these posts made, but there was really no accountability for them. There was no consequence. Ultimately, Kyrie Irving was suspended for a few games, but there was just a deluge of news surrounding this. People apologizing for him, but not him apologizing for himself. So my son asked as we were on our way to a basketball game to watch Kyrie play. Asked, why do they hate us? Can I not even go to the game? Does he not want me there? And I really was dumbfounded. I didn't know how to respond. And I said, you know, I don't have the answer for that, but I'm going to reach out to your school, because I'm sure this is something that they're addressing and dealing with and have the resources for. This was after the murder of George Floyd, and so we had already witnessed all of the investments, thankfully, into resources for our kids, and conversations, both at schools and the workforce, about racism, how to deal with racism, how to spot and identify it, other forms of hate. And I just assumed that that would include antisemitism. But when I reached out to the school and asked, you know, what are they doing on antisemitism, the response stunned me. I mean, it's basically nothing. And so as I said, the seed was planted that we really need to do something about this. There's a real void here. And then, of course, when the attacks of October 7 happened, you know, Yonit and I were on the phone and messaging every single day right after. And it was pretty quick, maybe two weeks later, when, you know, we'd already started seeing an uptick in antisemitism around the world and here in the US and New York as well, where we said, you know, we have to do something. And I said, I think we should write this book. We should write the book we couldn't find, that I couldn't find at the time. Because I did a bit of research, and there were really no books like this for this particular age group. Max Pashman: It was kind of answered in your other answer to the first question, but when I first read the book, I started wondering whether the incidents described in the book, were they taken from your experiences, or was it a realistic fiction book? Bianna Golodryga: I would say the inspiration for the athlete came from real life events. You know, I am a big sports fan as well, and I grew up watching basketball, and I have a lot of admiration for so many of these players, and I actually believe in redemption. And so people say things and they make mistakes, and I don't believe in purity tests. If people say things that are wrong, I think they have a right to apologize for it, make up for it. I don't like canceling people. We learn from our mistakes. We grow from our mistakes. No one's perfect. I think it's just more about accountability for all of us. And so the idea came about, yes, from real life, but you know, this is a soccer player in our book. I don't feel that he's very remorseful, even though ultimately he does have a quasi-apology. But you know, it's the impact that it has on society and fans and those who support him, especially like your age and my son's age, I think those are really the ones who hurt the most. Manya Brachear Pashman: Yeah, the impressionable minds. I mean, I thought the book did a lovely job of illustrating just how impressionable these young minds were, and then also how viral this was. I mean, once the celebrity athlete said his comments, what it unleashed. And, you know, you don't get into any violence. There's one incident that is rough, but brief, but it's, you know, the swastika painted on the locker, a rock through a window, but it's just that viral spread. I mean, was that your intent, to kind of illustrate this slow contagion? Bianna Golodryga: Yes, I think our kids are subject to so much more information than we were as kids and teenagers their age as well. You know, every society has had to deal with their challenges, and every generation has as well. And as we've said, antisemitism has been with us for millennia, but when you compound that with social media and the dangers. There's so many great things about social media. We have access to so much information, but then when you throw in disinformation, misinformation, you know, things going viral, news spreading, how much time people spend on social media sites and the influence that they succumb to by sometimes bad actors. So the book is not for antisemites, but I think what the book relays is what we've noticed, and sort of our theory, is that antisemitism has been somewhat accepted as part of society for far too long, and it's never been elevated to the level of urgency that other forms of hate has been. So I mentioned racism and post-George Floyd. I would think that if that much attention had been put into antisemitism as well, that people, especially children and those at school, would understand the gravity of antisemitism, and you know how much danger can be created from people who espouse antisemitic views and, you know, draw swastikas because they think it's funny, or they don't think it's such a big deal because they don't spend time talking about it, and they don't understand so much hate and so much pain that's behind these symbols. That's behind these words. And you know, we are such a small minority that so many times it's Jews that feel like they have to carry the weight and the burden of other people's actions, even if they don't mean to be as hurtful and as vile as some of this language is. So you said impressionable. That is why we are targeting this age group specifically, because it's such a magical age group. Kids Max's age, and my son's age, anywhere between nine and 15. They're very impressionable, but they still communicate with their families, their parents. They talk at dinner tables. They may not have social media accounts, but they are very well aware of what's going on in the world, and are very curious, and have access to so much good and bad. And so by not having this conversation at that age, you know, we're doing them a disservice, and I think we're doing ourselves a disservice as adults by not addressing these problems in this particular issue of antisemitism head on. Manya Brachear Pashman: I'm curious, once you identified that void in the school's curriculum and strategies for addressing prejudice, did they do anything to address that and to repair that void? I know a lot of Jewish parents are finding that really the burden falls on them to address these things in a very reactive manner. Not proactive. And I'm just curious what the situation ended up being at your school. Bianna Golodryga: I think we're starting, you know, without focusing as much on my school, because I feel that it's pretty obvious that that was status quo for many schools, not just in New York, but across the country, that you would have books and resources and materials on Hanukkah and Jewish holidays for kindergartners. And then some of the older kids in high school are introduced to the Holocaust. And some of these more challenging topics in areas in Jewish history to cover, and then the story sort of ends there. I don't know if it's because people are worried about conflating the Middle East and the conflict there with antisemitism, but there's a huge void, and it's something again, if you're 2% of the population and you are the victim of 70% according to the FBI, of all religious based violence, then there's a big problem. And the fact that that's not identified or discussed in schools, to us was just not acceptable. And so I think it's sort of a cop out to say no, it's because of the war. It's because of this. Antisemitism morphs and comes in different waves, and fortunately, I didn't experience much of it growing up. But that doesn't mean that, you know, it's not going to rear its ugly head again, and it has, and that was before the attacks of October 7. We obviously had the Tree of Life shooting. We had so many incidents around the world in the First Intifada, the Second Intifada, you know, dating before that, I don't remember growing up without security outside of my synagogue, or, you know, any Jewish institution. This is the best country in the world, but we've sort of come to accept that. And now, you know, we're at a place where I don't necessarily feel comfortable walking into a Jewish house of worship or institution without security. So we really, I think, wanted to send a message that these are conversations we should have been having for a long time now, and the best way to start it is with our kids, because, like Max, they have so many questions, and they also have so much empathy. Max Pashman: You mentioned your son being your main inspiration for it. Has he read the book? Bianna Golodryga: Oh, yes, I was the most nervous, and Yonit has three kids too, so we were the most nervous about appealing to them. It wasn't our editor or anybody else, our spouses, or even people in the industry that we cared about more than our kids, because we knew their reaction would really set the tone for you know kids like yourselves, and you're not a monolith. I know some kids like a certain book and some kids don't, but we wanted to make sure to write this book so it didn't feel like homework, so it didn't feel like you were forced to read it at school. And we wanted you to be able to identify with the characters and the story and find it really interesting, and oh, by the way, it just so happens to deal with the subject that we haven't really touched upon yet. So yes, my son really liked it. Both my kids really liked it. Manya Brachear Pashman: Would you agree, Max, that it didn't feel like homework? Max Pashman: Yeah, it felt like, well, a good book feels like, kind of like watching a movie, because it gives you enough details to the point where you can visualize the characters and kind of see what's going on. And that's also one of the reasons I like books more than movies, because it allows you to use your imagination to build the characters a little bit. But a good book doesn't just leave you with a general outline of what you want. It will give you the full picture, and then you can build most of the picture, and you can build off that with your mind. And I felt that it really did not feel like something that you were forced to read, because that's a lot less interesting. Bianna Golodryga: Well, that is the best review one could get, honestly, Max. And I can tell you you like a good book, and you're a voracious reader, and I agree with you 99.9% of the time, the book will always be better than the movie because of that detail, because of using your imagination. And so we wanted this to be a story that appealed to boys, girls, parents. You know, kids. It was very hard for us to say, Oh, here's our target audience, because we really wanted it to be an experience for every generation and for every position in life, from, you know, again, a kid, a parent, a teacher, a principal, a coach, grandparents. Manya Brachear Pashman: You know, it's interesting. You mentioned generations, and you mentioned being a Soviet refugee, and clearly you're outspoken about antisemitism. You're raising your children to be outspoken about antisemitism. What about your parents? How did they address antisemitism, or the form of antisemitism that they experienced? Bianna Golodryga: Yeah, I mean, as I said, we were so, I was so fortunate. I was like a piece of luggage. It was my parents who were courageous enough to decide to move to this country as Jewish refugees from the Soviet Union, where antisemitism was institutionalized. I mean, it was from top down. I mean, that was a mandated policy. And so my parents knew they didn't have a future. I didn't have a future in the Soviet Union. And so, of course, their dream was to come to the United States, and it was still the best decision they've ever made, and the best, you know, place I could have been raised. As I said, I was very fortunate to not really experience antisemitism as a kid. And mind you, I was the only Jewish student for many years at my first school, and we were the only Jewish family in our neighborhood for many years. Ultimately, my parents moved more into the center of the town and we always went to synagogue, so we were always around Jewish people and families, but the majority of my, especially early childhood friends, were not Jewish. And I have to say, for me, learning about antisemitism, it was more of a history lesson as to, like, why we left a certain country and why you can come to America and you're not identified as a Jew, by your race or religion. You're an American. I'm an American Jew. And you know, that's just not how people were identified in the Soviet Union, that that was their race. I mean, my birth certificate said Jew. My parents' library card said Jew. There were quotas and getting into good schools.And the types of jobs they could get. So for me, it was sort of backward looking, even knowing that, yes, antisemitism still exists, but it's sort of controlled. You know, once in a while we would have a bomb threat at our synagogue, and again, there were always police officers out there. And I noticed that was a difference from my friends' churches, because what ended up being sort of a beautiful tradition that my parents didn't intend to do, it just so happened to be the case that when I would have friends spend the night at my house, or I would spend a night at their house, sometimes they would come to Shabbat services with us, and I would go to church with them. And so for many of their congregants, I was the first Jewish person they'd ever seen. I was welcomed with open arms. But for you know, coming to my services, you know, it was the first time they'd been to a Jewish house of worship, and it was a very, very meaningful, I think, a great learning opportunity. But yeah, for me growing up, it wasn't a top priority. It wasn't top of mind just because I knew that I was an American Jew, and that was, that was who I was here. And it was only, you know, the last few years where I realized, you know, this is not something to be taken for granted. Max Pashman: I can definitely relate to being the only Jewish person in my class, because all through elementary school, there were no other Jewish kids in my grade. But as soon as I entered middle school, I met a few other kids who were Jewish. Who I've actually become very good friends with, and it's just like a lot more diversity. BIANNA; Yeah, that's great. I mean, I remember when I was in elementary school and it, you know, all the and we were trying to express this point too in the book, especially with Theo that, you know, so many kids at that age just want to be like everyone else. They don't want to stand out. And if you're the only Jewish kid you know on your soccer team, and all of a sudden you have practice or games right before Shabbat dinner, you know you're feeling the pressure, and you don't want to be excluded from your friends' activities after or have to keep reminding your coach, and it's incumbent on your coach and the adults in your life and who are not Jewish, to honor that, to respect that. To say, hey, we're going to move practice a little early, or, Hey, you know Theo, Max, I know you have Shabbat dinner, so we're going to, we're going to work on these, you know exercises 30 minutes before . . . you know, just to acknowledge that you are valued and you are respected. And that doesn't mean that everyone else's schedule needs to change because of yours, but it definitely doesn't mean that you have to walk on eggshells or feel like you're left out or stand out or different for all the wrong reasons because you have other responsibilities and plans. So for me, I remember as a kid, I was the only Jewish student in my elementary school, for the first elementary school I went to, and I remember leaving for winter break, and, you know, our principal getting on the intercom the loudspeaker, and wishing everyone, you know, Happy Holidays, Merry Christmas and Happy Hanukkah, Bianna. And I was like, Oh no, you know, I don't want to be excluded. And it wasn't out of malevolence, like it was just, I want to include. But at that point, I already had a funny last name. My parents had accents. I was from the Soviet Union, which was the enemy at the time, so I definitely stood out for a number of reasons. And on top of that, you know, I celebrate a different holiday. So yes, you know, we learn and grow from it, but we can remember, like I still remember it. Manya Brachear Pashman:
